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HORIZONTALY OPPOSED FLAT TWIN ENGINES 1923-39

 
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bthorby



Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Location: ANGUS,DD9 6LW.SCOTLAND UK

PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:02    Post subject: HORIZONTALY OPPOSED FLAT TWIN ENGINES 1923-39 Reply with quote

I am writing a book on the Aviation Applications of Douglas (Bristol UK)
and Aero Engines Ltd of Bristol,plus G & J Weir of Glasgow. A surprising
area. If anyone has material relating to the immediate pre-war period
especially the 1935 Monarch V-4/V6, and air-cooled blown V8,or side-valve (Ricardo) flat twin of 1937 I would be pleased to hear.
I also cover the Engine-Starter Engines (water and air-cooled ) for piston and jet projects;APU's from Wartime.
I'll try getting a life in 2008.

Best Wishes for Christmas

Brian Thorby
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wallan



Joined: 13 Jul 2003
Posts: 232
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:21    Post subject: Reply with quote

Put me down for a copy!

Are you also going to discuss the Weir engine built for their helicopter, mentioned in Caunter's Four-Stroke Aero Engines book?
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bthorby



Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Location: ANGUS,DD9 6LW.SCOTLAND UK

PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:51    Post subject: WEIR ENGINES Reply with quote

My Book encompasses the Weir Flat twin Engine ,erroneously referred to, even at the Museum that houses the W-2 Autogiro,as "Dryad 2",which is a cracker of a motor.Also ,I cover the 4 cylinder air-cooled inverted engine
which powered the W-2;W-3;W-4 Autogiros and the W-5 Helicopter .
Again, the 4 cyl is referred to erroneously in the "Literature".
I include these Weir engines because their designer came from Douglas
and the 4-cylinder was licenced back to Bristol in 1938.Aero Engines Ltd did some development and even designed a different head to the OHC.
So, my Title is "From Kingswood to Cathcart" (locations of the Douglas and Weir Factories).
Im glad my work is of interest to you.All I have to do is finish the thing!
I now have 38 types of aircraft to cover and a load of engines.serves me right.

Brian
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klankenau



Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 41
Location: Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 16:14    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of the most prolific and sucessful manufacturers of flat twin engines in the the UK during the pre-war (and pre-Great War) period was Jowett Cars of Bradford, Yorks. Their family of side valve flat twins were all water cooled and persisted up into the early post war period, the final use being in the Bradford van.

By comparison, their post-war Javelin/Jupiter flat four ohv was an entirely new design. Where the earlier twin was an almost indestructible lump, the new four definitely fell in somewhere near the bottom of the reliability spectrum, despite winning it's class at LeMan three years in sucession (1949-51).
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wallan



Joined: 13 Jul 2003
Posts: 232
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:30    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the reply. As I said, let me know when the book is ready! I'm curious as to the construction details of the 4 cylinder Weir engine as Caunter only describes it briefly.
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gwhite



Joined: 13 Jul 2003
Posts: 58

PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2007 09:20    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forgive my ignorance but is the Douglas you refer to the Douglas motor cycle company? As I am sure you are already aware of, Weir is mentioned fairly extensively in the Wolsely book. Most people think of Weir as the pump company, including me, until I read the Wolsely book.
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wallan



Joined: 13 Jul 2003
Posts: 232
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2007 09:40    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Graham, it's the same company. (someone on ebay last week was offering a flat twin that he claimed was either a Douglas or ABC aero engine) There are some details of Douglas aero engines here.

http://home.comcast.net/~aeroengine/Douglas.html

Hope they don't mind me posting the following:

William Douglas, Ltd. of Bristol, UK built motorcycle engines that were converted and developed by the firm into Douglas engines for light aircraft. According to Peter W. Brooks' book (PWB), the Douglas Dryad was the last engine design built before the Douglas firm closed at the end of 1932. The Dryad had been built to an order from G. and J. Weir, Ltd. of Cathcart, Glasgow, Scotland for application to the Weir W.1 autogiro (built under Cierva license with the designation Cierva C.2Cool. The designers of the Dryad were C.G. Pullin and G.E. Walker, who joined the Weir firm in 1933 and developed the Weir O-92 described below for the Weir W.2 autogiro. Pullin and Walker later designed the inverted inline four cylinder Weir Pixie engine for the Weir W.3 and W. 4 autogiros. Aero Engines, Ltd. of Bristol, UK was formed in 1935 and took over the Douglas plant. They planned to manufacture French Hispano-Suiza aircraft engines under license and purchased inverted inline engine designs from UK General Aircraft, Ltd. (Monarch) and from Weir (Pixie). During 1936-1937, Aero Engines also introduced two HOAE of their own design, the O-49 and the O-96, probably based on the Douglas and Weir engines (Ae39), although the details are not known by the compiler.
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fbarrett



Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 32
Location: Lakewood, Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 19:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

Friends:

Regarding Jowett, I remember driving by the works circa 1950 with my dad in his Bradford van. We then lived in Haxby, near York, but he was originally from Otley, a stone's throw from Bradford. He grew vegetables, and we often took them to the Shipley market. Later he used his van for all sorts of delivery services, etc. Jowett had a reputation as a "sensible" car for Yorkshiremen.

My library includes three books on Jowett:

The Complete Jowett History by Paul Clark & Edmund Nankivell.
Jowett Javelin & Jupiter by Geoff McAuley & Edmund Nankivell
The Jowett Jupiter, The Car that Leaped to Fame by (no prize for guessing) Edmund Nankivell

The first book contains this paragraph on aviation matters:

"[In about 1935], William [Jowett] along with his son Clarence, thought that there might be a market for a small and inexpensive aircraft. ...William bought a directorship in F. Hills & Sons Ltd., timber importer of Trafford Park, as they were in the process of constructing, under licence, the Czechoslovakian Praga E114 two-seater, to be known as the Hillson Praga. This aeroplane was powered by a 36hp Praga engine built under license by Jowett Cars Ltd. The first aircraft was tested at Barton aerodrome on 24 May 1936, and a total of 36 were eventually produced at the Trafford Park factory. At [pound symbol]385, it did not sell in any quantity to private owners although it was bought by a number of flying clubs. The venture was short-lived for Jowett, and William broke off his connection with Hills after only a year. He and Clarence, however, continued to toy with the idea of aircraft manufacture, especially as car manufacture in the late 1930s was becoming increasingly difficult."

I'll look through it for other aviation references.

Frank
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bthorby



Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Location: ANGUS,DD9 6LW.SCOTLAND UK

PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 06:51    Post subject: Douglas Light Aero Engines, from Kingswood to Cathcart Reply with quote

Dear Friends,
After more than 6 months of frustrating delay,probably familiar to experienced authors, I am pleased to report that my slim volume of 216 pages is about to be published. I shall sign off the Proofs this week;the typesetting and Covers are done, so although Redcliffe Press are still saying January 2010, we are nearly there. I hope some of you are curious enough to say "I cant wait".
I burnt the last disc of drawings and photographs in March, with 122 pictures and 47 drawings accompanying 36,000 words.
What was originally just a personal file, regarding aviation applications, to go with my Douglas motorcycle gen, became masses of research material surrounding 13 engine projects and over 50 types of airframe
(or ground-frame) which they powered.Anoraks are not dead.
If you wish to read a bit more about this book,please see "Forthcoming etc" at www.redcliffepress.co.uk

Best Wishes

Brian Thorby
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klankenau



Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 41
Location: Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 14:28    Post subject: Reply with quote

We've been making small numbers of Douglas Dragonfly distributor caps and rotors for UK motorcycle enthusiasts. They use a two piece Miller cap, very similar to the pre-war Delco caps.

On another related subject, a customer came in several year ago (R & D Aeronautical) and asked to buy some of our pre-war Delco six cylinder caps, said he needed it for a two cylinder McCullough engine. When I told him that those engines were used in target drones, he told me that was exactly his application.

Seems when he retired out of Douglas (Long Beach), he was in charge of the drone line. They were in the process of reorganizing the production lines and there would not be enough room to maintain that marginal product. For a nominal sum, he acquired everything and the drones are still in production, mostly for smaller countries like Chile, Finland, etc. Most of his business today is for spares and he comes in about once a year to restock.
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klankenau



Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 41
Location: Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 14:33    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almost forgot, the two cylinder McCullough engines use a six cylinder pre-war Delco cap. In this application it is used in a typical aircraft dual ignition set up (two cylinders w/two spark plugs each and two coils).
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bthorby



Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Location: ANGUS,DD9 6LW.SCOTLAND UK

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 15:37    Post subject: The Book is finally at the Press Reply with quote

My effort is now in the hands of the Printer (in S. Wales) with publication before end of January.It seems a long time since I submitted all the text
and illustrations to the publisher ( 9months!) but at last its all committed.
In the chapter on Competitive (to Douglas) power plants of the period, I have excluded those above 2 litres( 122 cu in) and from the USA, such as Morehouse and Jacobs, as there was little opportunity for head-to-head sales. In contrast, I have included the peculiar (for 1924) Australian monosoupape twin cylinder design by Wackett; the Wizard. The final format of 'Douglas Light Aero Engines from Kingswood to Cathcart' is 242 x 172mm (9.53" x 6.8") and 232 pages. One saving grace of the delay was discovery of a sole surviving 2 litre four-cylinder air-cooled in-line ohc Aero Engines Pixie.
A photo was duly inserted in the relevant chapter for extant engines and airframes.
Best Wishes to all AEHS members for 2010.

Brian Thorby
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bthorby



Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Location: ANGUS,DD9 6LW.SCOTLAND UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 07:10    Post subject: DOUGLAS LIGHT AERO ENGINES..from Kingswood to Cathcart" Reply with quote

I am pleased and relieved to confirm that my book is available, at last.
It may be ordered direct from Redcliffe Press, Bristol, UK .

E-MAIL sales@redcliffepress.co.uk
TEL 0117 9737207
www.redcliffepress.co.uk

If you would like more information on content etc from me,please
contact via brithorby@yahoo.co.uk

Thank you.
Brian Thorby
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wallan



Joined: 13 Jul 2003
Posts: 232
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 03:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

gwhite wrote:
Forgive my ignorance but is the Douglas you refer to the Douglas motor cycle company? As I am sure you are already aware of, Weir is mentioned fairly extensively in the Wolsely book. Most people think of Weir as the pump company, including me, until I read the Wolsely book.


It was Lord Weir, (he might have still been Sir William at the time) of the same company who put all the eggs in the same basket with the ABC Dragonfly engine, in the First World War. Then his son dumped the helicopter at the start of the Second World War!
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